« Fox News Republican Debate - January 10, 2008 | Main | CNN South Carolina Democratic Debate, January 21, 2008 »
MSNBC Democratic Debate - January 15, 2008
By Bill | January 15, 2008 | Email This Post
At 9pm Eastern time on January 15, 2008, MSNBC is hosting a Democratic debate from the Cashman Center in Las Vegas, Nevada, ahead of the Nevada Caucus to be held on January 19th. The debate will be cosponsored by the United States Hispanic Chamber of Commerce, IMPACTO, the African American Democratic Leadership Council, 100 Black Men of America, and the College of Southern Nevada. The moderator will be Brian Williams, assisted by Tim Russert and Natalie Morales.
I’ll be live blogging the debate as it unfolds, with a summary of the major points offered by each candidate. My goal is to provide a largely unfiltered representation of what the candidates say, but I can’t resist commenting along the way, so my editorial comments will appear in italics.
I hope you join in and comment along… honest debate is quite welcome, trolls and flame wars are not. See you at 9pm. My reactions will be coming out as they happen with minimal editing - my apologies in advance for any grammatical or other similar errors. I don’t claim that this represents everything the candidates said, but I believe this will be an accurate and fair summary of the major points.
While we’re waiting for tonight’s event to start, feel free to take a look at the last one of these I did, the Fox News Republican Debate from January 10.
-Bill
3:00 PM update: as of now, there’s a chance the debate might be cancelled. NBC has decided to invite only the top three finishers from the New Hampshire Democratic primary, which means Clinton, Obama, and Edwards. Dennis Kucinich says that he was originally asked to participate, but that NBC withdrew the invitation, and now he’s suing to be included. A judge is considering whether to issue an injunction stopping the debate from proceeding.
8:25 PM: The Nevada Supreme court has ruled that the debate can go on without Kucinich.
It’s 9PM… away we go!
Hillary Clinton:
- Race and gender shouldn’t be part of the campaign. Everyone on the stage has benefited from Dr. King’s work.
- Asked if she will dismiss a staffer who made comments about things Obama used to do “in the neighborhood,” Clinton says that that individual has apologized, and people should listen to the candidates and not their staffers, anyway.
- Says that the fact Bush is in the Middle East asking the Saudis to lower the price of oil is “pathetic.” My comment: hasn’t basically every President for the last thirty years ended up doing that at some point?
- Asked if Obama is “prepared to be President” says “that’s up for the voters to decide.”
- Believes her greatest strength is he experience standing up for children, which she says is “her life’s work,” thinks she can deliver change and enable people to live up to their God-given potential. Greatest weakness is that she’s impatient and occasionally comes across that way.
- Differs from Obama in that she things a President should have to be the Chief Executive Officer. Differs from Obama, saying that we’ve seen the fallout of a self-running system in the Bush Administration.
- Asked about foreign ownership of big United States companies: said she’s quite concerned, particularly in the case where foreign money is a front for foreign governments and organizations. Thinks we’re in the position we are at least partially because of the subprime mortgage crisis, and the current administration has no idea what should be done.
- Defended her vote for a banking reform bill that Edwards regrets voting for by saying that it had some things in it that she agreed with, some things she disagreed with, and that on the whole she’s glad it didn’t become a law.
- Said that many of the economic issues they’re discussing tonight are “black and brown” issues, of particular interest to minorities who are often the most victimized.
- Believes there’s a danger that George W. Bush will try to “tie the hands” of the next President by entering in to an agreement with Iraq to keep American troops there far beyond the end of his Presidency. Asks Obama if he will co-sponsor her legislation to prevent Bush from doing so. (Obama’s response: we can work on that.)
- Voted against Yucca mountain and doesn’t believe the site is supported by science. Says her record on the subject is better than that of Obama and Edwards, who Clinton says voted twice in favor of it.
- Calls the 2005 energy bill the “Dick Chaney, lobbyist” energy bill, and that it was a big step backwards for renewable energy.
- Proposes a “strategic energy fund,” which would provide $20 billion to research clean, renewable, green energy.
- “I am against illegal guns” (My comment: now there’s a bold statement.)
- Believes that the “political winds” are against getting guns off the street. We need to crack down on illegal gun dealers and enforce the laws on the books. Clinton would work to reintroduce the ban on “assault weapons.” Asked: “but you’ve backed off a national licensing plan” Answer: “Yes.”
- Affirms her belief in the second amendment.
- Decided to run for President over the last New Years.
John Edwards:
- Being from the south, Edwards feels a personal responsibility to move forward on racial issues, citing his memory of the events at the Woolworth’s lunch counter when he was growing up.
- A viewer asks why, as a woman, she should forgo voting for the first viable female candidate and the first viable African-American candidate for President in favor of Edwards. Edwards responds that she should listen to his policies, and vote for him because for him the issues are “personal” and that he’s the best candidate for the job.
- Denies that he and Obama were “piling on”Clinton in the last debate, though understands how it may have seemed that way.
- Believes lobbyists and special interests are holding America back from change.
- Edwards says his greatest strength is his experience fighting on behalf of the middle class, because it shows he has what it takes inside to stand up for the little guy. Greatest weakness is that he’s occasionally consumed by emotion when faced with very personal stories of people in need.
- The fundamental problem with foreign investment is that the majority of economic growth in America is with the wealthiest Americans and the biggest corporations while the middle class is faced with uncertainty. The great challenge of this election is to ensure that our children and grandchildren have better lives than we did, as previous generations did for us.
- We need universal health care, a dramatic transition of how we generate and use energy (creating a million jobs in the process), a crackdown on payday and high interest lenders, and lower cost loans for people to attend college.
- Called for a national minimum wage of $9.50 an hour.
- Edwards will end American combat missions in Iraq and there will be no permanent military bases there while he’s President.
- Promises to end combat missions during his first year as President.
- Is opposed to Yucca mountain.
- Edwards is against building more nuclear power plants because we don’t have a way to dispose of the waste, they aren’t safe, they are targets for terrorists, and they’re just too expensive.
- Doubling the number of nuclear plants tomorrow would only address 1/7 of greenhouse gas emissions… “this is not the answer.”
- Says we need to break the hold energy special interests has on the economy, and says Clinton has received more donations from them than any other candidate.
- Believes we should have a moratorium on construction of new coal-fired energy plants until we have the carbon sequestration technology worked out.
- Says that illegal aliens should be fined before being allowed to become citizens, because we can’t pretend they didn’t break the law in the first place.
- Believes that learning English should be a requirement for earning citizenship, but that we should help them doing it.
- Edwards says we need universal pre-K and second chance schools for people who drop out of high school.
- While Edwards believes that Americans have the right to bear arms, he also believes that it doesn’t follow that they have the right to an “AK-47.” As President, would support a restriction on assault rifles.
- Made the decision to run for President December a year ago, because he decided he could best fight for the “cause of his life” - meaning the middle class, and against the special interests - as President.
Barack Obama:
- Race has always been an issue in American politics, but Clinton and Edwards have always worked for racial equality, and the important thing is that they come together as a party.
- The outcome of the Iowa caucus is proof that America can move beyond historical racial divides and judge each candidate individually on his or her message.
- Asked if he regrets his comment from the last debate, “You’re likeable enough, Hillary.” Obama regrets it because the comment was not received in the spirit he meant it. My Comment: I agree, having watched the debate, I didn’t think it was mean-spirited, more joking, along the lines of “If you weren’t so likable I wouldn’t have to campaign so hard.”
- Feels that the President ought to be “a visionary” in contrast to just a chief operating officer.
- Says his greatest strength is the ability to bring people of different perspectives together. Greatest weakness: has asked his staff to hand him paper two minutes before he needs it, because he will lose it… says he needs people around him to help him run a system for greatest effectiveness. (Prediction… someone will criticize him for this… Update: yep, Senator Clinton just did.)
- Said George W. Bush had some good qualities, including that he was probably on time all the time, but that he couldn’t accept viewpoints that were different than his.
- Asked frankly about Internet claims that he’s a Muslim and took his oath of office on the Koran, says that he is in fact a Christian, took his oath of office on the Bible, and that the American people are smart enough to see these rumors for what they are.
- The foreign investment problem is compounded by American money going overseas to purchase oil while we ignore alternative energy resources. The reason for the subprime mortgage mess is because the Bush administration hasn’t provided proper regulatory oversight of the mortgage industry.
- Suggests exempting middle class taxpayers from increases in capital gains taxes.
- Mentions Warren Buffet’s recent comment that he’s in a lower tax bracket than his secretary, saying that it’s not fair that working income is subject to a greater tax than investment income.
- Obama insinuates that it’s not fair that if he gets a campaign donation from a middle manager at a drug company, it’s counted as a contribution from the pharmaceutical industry, even if it’s not part of an organized campaign. (My comment: how do you prove organization? Don’t unions and other groups “encourage” donations like this all the time?)
- Promises to “end the war in Iraq as we know it.”
- Promises to end the Yucca mountain project, but admits we need to figure out how to store nuclear waste. Promises to gather expert opinions and come up with a solution that is good for America as well as the people of Las Vegas.
- Believes we should pursue nuclear energy if we can find a safe way to build plants. Believes in a “menu of energy options.”
- Says alternative energy is good, but if we are going to address climate change we must reduce energy usage. Believes this can be accomplished by making appliances more efficient without reducing our standard of living.
- Believes minority and poor youth don’t get the educational support they need, and calls for after school programs. Believes we have the answers to fix education but that the current administration has not made it a priority.
- Singles out African American fathers as a group that hasn’t met its responsibility to their kids.
- Believes we have two Americas in terms of gun ownership: lawful owners, and abuses of guns we see on the street. Thinks we can reconcile the two worlds.
- Decided to run for President in December 2006. The two factors in his decision were 1) would his family suffer from the race, and 2) should he seek the office? Decided yes because 1) (humorously) “his wife is extraordinary and his children are above average, and 2) he believes he can be an agent for change.
Summary / Comments
- 8:55 PM: This should be interesting tonight. Clinton and Obama, of course, have been sniping at each other all week because of Bill Clinton’s “fairy tale” comment, Clinton’s comment about MLK’s dream, etc. They’ve theoretically called a truce, but then again they haven’t been on stage together, either. Clinton is fresh off the New Hampshire win that vaulted her back over Obama for the front runner position, and she’s now reportedly consulting old Bill Clinton advisers James Carville and Paul Begala… could mean ramped-up fireworks from Ms. Clinton. Meanwhile, Edwards is desperate to make an impression on voters that will allow him to carry the upcoming South Carolina race and breathe life back into his campaign. All that against the backdrop of Kucinich being excluded from the debate and a Michigan Democratic primary that was laughable, since of all the major candidates only Clinton was on the ballot. Should be fun… we’ll see.
- 9:03 PM: Brian Williams says that “lights will warn the candidates of the end of time” … wow, an Armageddon light. Cool.
- 9:03 PM: MSNBC projects Mitt Romney as the winner of the Republican race in Michigan.
- 9:04 PM: First up, Brian Williams asks about the whole MLK question: “Ms. Clinton, how did we get here?”
- All the candidates are playing nice so far, smart of them. The campaigns can slug it out, but they’ve got to take the high road when questioned directly. Besides, does anyone really think Bill Clinton made an anti-Black comment?
- 9:22 PM: Someone in the audience is yelling a question/comment… can’t make out what he’s saying, though I thought I caught the phrase “race based.”
- 9:23 PM: One of Clinton’s early talking points tonight seems to be the economy… shades of “It’s the economy, stupid?”
- Hillary has mentioned church and God a couple of times already tonight… she’s turning downright conservative on us.
- Obama’s comment about Bush and punctuality: someone’s going to liken this to the famous statement that “Mussolini made the trains run on time.” Surely he didn’t mean it that harshly? (Though some on the left probably would.)
- 9:49 PM: Clinton just said she’s glad a banking reform bill for which she voted didn’t become a law… so why’d she vote for it? Her opponents will be all over this one.
- 9:50 PM: Clinton just referred to the subprime mess and other economic problems as primarily “black and brown” issues… can you imagine if Romney or one of the other candidates said that? There would be a media riot. Let’s see if Clinton gets similarly criticized.
- On Warren Buffet’s secretary: According to this article, she makes $60,000 a year while Buffet makes $46 million a year. Read that again… Warren Buffet’s secretary makes $60,000 a year. He should give her a damn raise.
- 10:00 PM: The candidates are asking each other questions. The first couple are opportunities for grandstanding, not actually asking questions.
- What questions there are from the other candidates have been to Obama. What can we make of that?
- 10:14 PM: Tim Russert just mentioned “rot-cee” college programs, referring to ROTC. Am I the only one who’s never heard it actually pronounced, as opposed to spelled out? Arr-Oh-Tee-Cee?
- 10:20 PM: Brian Williams didn’t make any friends in the Las Vegas chamber of commerce: “As sure as there is somebody at a roulette wheel not far from here sure he’s about to win it all back…”
- 10:31 PM: Edwards throws out carbon sequestration … there’s your new buzzword for the next five years.
- 10:34 PM: There’s Clinton mentioning “black-brown” issues again, twice in one sentence.
- Natalie Morales looks a bit like Maria Shriver.
- 10:38 PM: Clinton again says this is a “black-brown” debate, this time in reference to education.
Okay, the debate is over. Here’s Keith Olbermann… Sportscenter isn’t the same without him.
- Winner: Clinton.
- Obama and Edwards also did well. That’s enough for Obama, but Edwards really had to make a move, and he did not.
- This may have been the most substantive conversation so far, though that’s not saying much.
- So much for the fireworks that I was anticipating, other than Clinton’s shots at George W. Bush. Must have been a note from the DNC to be civil.
- Again, Clinton seemed to really hit the economy tonight… this is a smart strategic move for her. If she can link her candidacy to the economy of the 1990s under the former President Clinton, she’ll be hard to touch on the subject.
- Chris Matthews is pointing out that by attacking President Bush, Clinton is painting herself as the front runner and reducing the Obama and Edwards to also-rans. He’s right… nice one, Hillary.
- Clinton also stole Obama’s “change” thunder tonight… he needs to grab that back if he’s to have a chance.
That’s it for tonight. See you next time.
-Bill
January 15th, 2008 at 11:38 pm
You never heard Rot cee—how old are you? ten?
Definitely from the generation before media deregulation. Ever heard a newscast?
We need those back!
January 15th, 2008 at 11:54 pm
Nope, I just surveyed the people I’m watching with, and none of them had ever heard it either. Even the (admittedly, few) people I’ve known who have actually been in it have referred to it by the letters. I just looked it up, though, and apparently “rot-cee,” (or “rotsea”) is an accepted pronunciation, so the ignorance is ours. (Maybe it’s regional?)
As far as a newscast… my memory goes back no further than Cronkite, for whatever that’s worth.